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Flick's Chariot (Read 43803 times)
Geno
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #50 - 02/10/22 at 14:34:18
 
Very nice setup John. I enjoyed the video - sounds fantastic!

From the look on your cats face, you must have been playing "Cat Scratch Fever" Smiley
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #51 - 02/10/22 at 15:17:41
 
Thanks Geno. How are you feeling?
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Geno
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #52 - 02/10/22 at 15:29:04
 
I'm on the mend, and back at work today after being off for 4 work days and the weekend. Thanks for asking.

Best,

Geno
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Lon
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #53 - 02/10/22 at 15:38:24
 
Great news Geno.
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Geno
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #54 - 02/10/22 at 16:02:27
 
Thank you, Lon.
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #55 - 02/10/22 at 18:16:38
 
Good for you Gino! Happy to hear!

John
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #56 - 02/10/22 at 18:28:53
 
That's good news Gino!
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #57 - 03/11/22 at 11:16:19
 


A stage of metamorphosis! So many ideas so little time before trees bud.

John
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #58 - 09/27/23 at 12:56:47
 
It has been a while since the last post. Some progress has been made in the charoit. The Otari found a favorable placement on the isolation stage. The Wicked One is now being used as a sub for the Crystal 10s. The couch was replaced with a lazy boy recliner. A thousand or so vinyl, tape, and concert DVDs have been placed for culling. Organized mess Wink


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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #59 - 10/12/23 at 10:00:43
 
Spent a day cleaning out the audio graveyard(storage room). Ended up placing the 18hz subs from the DJ setup in the listening room. Powered with the 350 watt plate amps set 180 degrees out of phase the subs add that feel of subsonic frequencies to the music that has it. These may become a permanet fixture in the room. It is starting to look like some other prominate room in this forum Smiley

John
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Kamran
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #60 - 10/15/23 at 22:57:53
 
Love the room/setup John!  Is that the Otari MX5050?
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #61 - 10/16/23 at 15:02:19
 
That be it, Kamran. Going to make a couple of oak side panels to replace the stock black plastic laminated ones. The oak ones will tilt and bring the 5050 up to a workable seated height but not too much to hide the center channel HT speaker.

The latest acquisition found on a family farm that was purchased new by the family great grandfather in 1928. The granddaughter wanted it to go to someone that would appreciate and use it. The motor runs good but sound box needs rebuilt. Heck, anything this old needs a complete service overhaul to last another century. The cabinet shows its age but solid without any lamination issues. I been looking for a Victrola Orthophonic for a couple months weeding through junk. This unit is one of the most popular units ever produced by Victrola. Its is also at the apex of Victrola's history before the power amplifier proliferation. A great find with minimal outlay!
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Kamran
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #62 - 10/17/23 at 02:39:44
 
Great find indeed!
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #63 - 10/25/23 at 03:07:35
 
It has been a rough month but got a few things accomplished that have been on the backburner.
Album cases completed ✔
Diffusers lowered  ✔

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Tony
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #64 - 10/25/23 at 04:20:51
 

Nice room!
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #65 - 03/02/24 at 12:38:41
 
Edited:
Added some horn detail pictures and did some much needed editing. Sorry for the poor read folks. I just was in a hurry to jump on the bike yesterday and excited to share my latest adventure here.


Thanks Tony! It has really progressed to my liken the last year or so! It does seem that one step forward causes some pause adding one step back.

Let me explain 🤔

I've been bitten by the Victrola bug. First with a purchase of a 1920 table model that was in shambles. Toiling with it gave a new appreciation of early american woodworking craftsmanship and horn design. Horns always attracted my interest as well as the calming effect of tooling wood ending with usually a beautiful eye pleasing product. Once the 1920 model was repaired, I ended up with a good understanding of Victrolas history and access to suppliers that had the necessary parts for the table models repair.

That led to my next purchase of a 1924 Consolette that was in a little better shape then the table model but still needed parts to get it working properly. The attraction for me was it had a orthophonic sound box with a larger horn which simply means a better frequency response of about 150 to 3000 hz! That is about it for frequency range of these old players.

The horns for the above mentioned models are basically a straight curved design that use the little knowledge known about horns back in the early 20s but showed improvement over time in the learning process.

The ultimate in Victrolas horn design before RCA bought the fledgling company in '29 was the Credenza with it's folded horn in a cabinet that when unfolded measured almost 7' in length and kept a true tapered form without sharp corners. The larger horn got the low end to just below 100hz but the high end also dropped because of cancellation created when higher frequencies traveled thru the lengthy horn. Just had to have one of these! The search began.

Interesting note is the lids on the other two Victrolas have a notice to close the lid while playing but the Credenza does not. I think it is related to the long horn and desire to get a higher frequency response by adding the little bit created from the needle, soundbox, and articulate upper horn by leaving the lid open.


Two candidates showed up in Facebook Marketplace. One was a eastern five hour drive away and the other a short western 30 minute commute. The closer one was in fair condition while the other was in good shape. I had a long chat with the guy who owned the nicer item but logistics was not in our favor. The person with the other one was not very communicative and my offer was ignored after limited messages. At this point, a decision was made to just be happy with the two in my possession even though logistics seem to become less of an issue with a new car purchase. The biggest new stumbling block was placement in our home. It became a real challenge. Even though I gave up on the purchase the feeling of incompletion lingers.

Like a stroke of lightning a message was received from marketplace by the person with the closer Credenza that stated a willingness to give it up for free. She said just come and pick it up! Blew my mind to instant mobilizing. The unit would fit in the new compact SUV. Gathering a few tools I left in a hours time. She opted for a porch pick up with no provided help. I wrongly thought that by removing the motor(electric)/platter assembly it could be placed in the back of the SUV by myself. The Consolette was manageable doing that. Well, when pulling up to the front of her house the Credenza was magnificently set at the top edge of 6 or so steps leading to the porch. It was an impressive sight and foretelling of the need for another set of hands to get it loaded. With a 4 way screwdriver, I disassembled it completely(except for the horn structure) while waiting for help to arrive.

While waiting, the lady came out and we had a good chat on the history of the Credenza that was her mothers. Indecision on her mothers part of letting it go caused the delay in response to me because it has been in the family since new. The daughter wanted to give it to someone that will take time for restoration and asked for a video when complete.

Oh, the misses claimed the Consolette for her space in the living room. There is a corner in the living room that sported a floor lamp and she pointed to that area and said "that Consolette will fit there." I was kind of shocked that she would want it in her proclaimed space but happy nonetheless. So it all worked out to fit at home. She is playing it now as I post this.


The Credenza at home in the Chariot. When recieved the motor did not work, the horn support bracket needed replaced(common on most Victrolas), air cylinders for the lid needed rebuilt, and it needed completely cleaned of coal dust. Three days of of work and $122.50 for parts and help got the Credenza up and running well.


Picture of where the sound is split at the end of the cast horn. This is where the horn wood craftsmanship begins. Constructed much like a barrel to form a exponential horn. The little thing hanging in the upper right might be a problem where the horn might have lost it's air tightness. Will have to take a closer look in the future.


Opposite view of the cast horn mouth from inside one of the split horn chambers.


View of the final split in one side before entering the final chamber as picture with the Credenza in the Chariot without a grill cloth.


Shot of the rear casting and one of the buckets of water full of coal dust after wiping cabinet interior surfaces.

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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #66 - 03/02/24 at 20:57:54
 
Hey John,

The Chariot is looking better than ever!!   Love the recent acquisitions..especially the Otari !!  I couldn’t help but notice your white ZP3.  Boy how I would love to complete my system with a white topped ZP3.  Hint hint hint!! 😉. It goes without saying that if you ever decide to part with that ZP3 and upgrade…please let me know.  

Speaking of tape… one of my co-workers brother used to have a tape machine that is no longer being used.  I don’t know what make it is, but I’ve been bugging him to ask his brother if he wants to sell it.  Adding a tape machine would really be the icing on the cake.  

Keep the updates and the progress coming.  

Dom




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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #67 - 03/05/24 at 13:48:32
 
For sure Dom, how could I not keep the updates flowing. I suffer like some of us here with less passionate local audiophile folks that appreciate quailty music.

Might have to will the ZP3 to you Grin

Once bitten with tape there is no turning back. Good luck with your acquisition.
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #68 - 03/05/24 at 23:16:01
 
I would make sure that ZP3 stays in pristine condition if it was willed😁.  I know the tape machine is the like holy grail, so I’m really hoping it will materialize.  Looking forward to the future updates and acquisitions.  

Dom
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #69 - 03/22/24 at 17:15:18
 
Got around to make a video for the past owner of the Credenza in action. Refinish will have to wait for a winter project.

https://youtu.be/uX-ut3gyoac?si=WYnR_vPgIVUNDcCH
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #70 - 03/23/24 at 01:05:49
 
Hey John…..what a vintage sound!!  I can only imagine how much better it sounds in person.  Once you start refinishing the credenza, please keep us posted on the progress.  

What song were you playing?  I tried using Sound Hound but it it didn’t pull anything from the archives.
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #71 - 03/23/24 at 09:58:08
 
I think that there won't be much sanding refinishing the Credenza.The walnut veneer is around 1/16" thickness and all the trim is solid walnut. A good set of cabinet scrapers and a little finish stripper will do.

Shot of the 10" RCA shellac disk side played in the video.
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #72 - 03/23/24 at 13:49:45
 
Well done,

Looks and sounds great.

JD
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Dominick
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Still like that old
time Rock and Roll!!

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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #73 - 03/23/24 at 17:24:36
 
Awesome. Thanks John.  Qobuz does have the artist, but that song didn’t pop up. Going to have to dig a bit further, and maybe check Tidal.  

Sometimes a piece of vintage equipment is best to be left in its original state…minus a clean up.  Either way the player is a great piece.
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JBzen
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #74 - 03/24/24 at 14:44:48
 
Thanks guys.

I think that the Consolette will get a refinish first(misses already hinted for that). Depending on the outcome the Credenza which has higher value might follow.
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Kamran
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Sarah

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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #75 - 03/24/24 at 17:32:34
 
Loved the vid John! Such a classic look and sound!
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #76 - 04/14/24 at 12:01:17
 
Just got a new addition for the Charoit. It is a new petite battery operated record player that reminds me of a women's clutch. Got it with a vinyl lot purchase. 90 albums and 2 record players for $20! I bought the last lot of 100 albums from this guy that ended up 50% trash but what can one expect for $10. The other record player is also trash but the Lloyd's one needed some work and is dear to me. It works good now after mending the platter support with a bit of solder, new foam for the battery compartment, some epoxy resetting the lid fastener, and a good cleaning. Plays 45 and 33 records with that old fashion Japanese tinny sound of portable electronics back in the 60s. My dad had a Lloyd's AM/FM radio back in the 60's and I had a stereo one with separating speakers. That one was stolen from me. This record player is a 9 out of 10 cosmetically and 10 in operation. I already ordered a new needle just to be sure.



The red dot by the volume dial is not a light. It is just painted on. Funny, I think it was done that way to conserve the battery and remind the user to turn it off. That thought did not work for me because I left in on all night killing the 4D batteries! Heck, 4 new batteries will probably cost just about what the first record lot cost!

The record is spun by the rubber wheel(shown in the photo above) in contact with dead wax. Stylus arm rests on a button switch turning off the motor when changing records. Platter support jockeys to different positions changing speeds.

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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #77 - 10/01/24 at 13:12:47
 
Reading a fellow poster's story in this forum about his system not sounding just right after a few updates, I went his route with the Chariot's system. That is the cleaning of mechanical connections. Some RCA male and female connectors, IEC connectors, fuse and recepticals, etc. were cleaned. Spent an hour or so the other day doing so but there is more to do when time allows. Using a 70% solution of rubbing alcohol and various applicators the picture below shows the residue lifted from the connectors. The newer the connectors, less was removed. It was the older ones that really showed the need for this exercise. I have not listened to the result yet. Want to do a complete cleaning before doing so.


I also added a Swiss Digital Fuse Box to the Decware components with rectifiers. A breakout box was devised so all three of the units could be daisy chained to one SDFB. I used the gold infused Sluggo that came with the fuse replacement device in the SE84 and #4 copper wire in the remaining fuse holders. That project can be seen here:
https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1677858218/738#738

Not sure what it did but seem to create a blacker background. I also added the Decware DHC3 power cables at the same time. This may have help with the background noise along with the new sluggo. In all fairness, the system has been running without fuses for the last couple of years but the SDFB will allow me peace of mind with overload protection.

Oh! A Snubway was also added. This device definitely lowered the noise floor and the main reason for the breakout box project. The odd spaced duplex receticals gives much needed room for a Snubway IMO.
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #78 - 12/18/24 at 18:24:41
 
Some progress in the Chariot and corridors of interest.
This free air dust collector is much appreciated by the misses!
One side of the shop with essentials and a tight squeeze for indoor parking.

The other side.

It is a pleasure to be able to work around the bench!

The bikes and accessories in there own area! Ahhh, At last!

Back wall of Charoit missing the diffusers.

Front showing new seating position.

HVAC corridor looking from the new electronic shop.

Entrance for the shop with soldering station.

Back of shop showing record cleaning area.

Still a bit to get it complete. If all goes well I'll be ready with all updates and repairs to recieve a new SE84UFO25 from Decware in a year or so.
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Geno
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would be a mistake.

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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #79 - 12/18/24 at 19:27:55
 
Nice John!  I take it that the tighter listening triangle you have is the result of trying to get the optimum sound out of the Carver C-9?

Having a little experience with this technology years ago, I was ready to dip my toe back in the water again too, but my room simply will not work. Would have been cool to hear what was to offer.

Congratulations on the excellent living/working/playing space that you have created. Well done!

Best,

Geno
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mrchipster
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #80 - 12/19/24 at 00:10:23
 
Nice work JB!

It's been cool to follow the build and evolution of your room. I'm sure you get some awesome sound in there.

Now with the addition of separate spaces for your multitude of hobbies, you may never leave your lower level. When you've had enough of listening to tunes, you can go play in one of the other rooms and vice versa. Seems like a great way to break up the winter. I know you'll be chomping at the bit to get outdoors when the weather breaks but enjoy what you've just created in the meantime.
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CAJames
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #81 - 12/19/24 at 03:18:31
 
Nice bikes!  🚴
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[FOOBAR2000 | Jay's CDT2 MRK3] -> Denafrips Terminator 2 + Gaia
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #82 - 12/20/24 at 12:03:14
 
Geno, yes the tighter listening triangle is a result of Carters recommendations on how to get the most out of the C9. This created a slight drop in bass but it seems to hit better.
For what these units are going for, you should give it a go. It might add favorably to your set up as it sets. It did to mine but wanted to see what would happen if I followed the recommendations of Carter.

Mrchipster, what this does is give me a better mindset to react on an impulse without the drudge of exhaustion(setting, finding, digging, etc). That is a front and center thought of us seniors Smiley This has been on my mind for years. I think that my absence from home for an extended period gave me enough incentive to "get er done". I am hoping to have it completed by this coming new year.

CAJames, I was able to prepare two bikes for rides and did much needed maintenance(new tires on both, chain and cassette on one) in about the same amount of time that it would have taken me just to pull one of those out preparing it for a ride in the past. Have you been riding? All this home work cut me back lately but still managing 80 a week average.

Thanks guys!
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #83 - 12/20/24 at 16:22:20
 
Quote:
CAJames,

...Have you been riding? All this home work cut me back lately but still managing 80 a week average.


Yes I have! In fact one of my buddies wants to do a century in March so I've been piling on the miles, and the hills. This is (typically) the best time of year to ride around here, and the weather has been (mostly) spectacular. I'm not exactly sure how Strava works but if "Jalama Road" is a thing that is my big ride. Only downside is it is cutting into my listening time...
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Dominick
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #84 - 12/21/24 at 16:34:12
 
Hey John… Love to set up!! I love the soldering station and the upgraded listening space.  Kudos on the the big score of the 90 vinyl albums at a ridiculous price.   Keep the updates and photos coming.  Off for the next 6 days…so I’m hoping to up my listening time.  

Happy listening!

Dom
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #85 - 12/22/24 at 12:49:00
 
Hi Dom,
Can't wait to fine tune the area with needed updates and repairs. There are over 500 LPS that need cleaned in another area that will get tuned with use. That sold oak brown cabinet on the left in the HVAC corridor picture was giving to me by a fellow cyclist. It was custom made in England for record storage and shipped over by his deceased father-in-law. I almost got crushed helping him carry it down a tight flight of stairs! His mother-in-law was very appreciative of it's disposal. Both his in-laws are from over the pond.
Thanks!

CAJames, if your on Strava we can follow each other. We could also ride together on the day of your century with the app. That is if I'm up to speed in March. It's 18 degrees now outside with a high expected in the 20s. In those temps, the ride is shortened a good bit. I hate trainer use! PM me if interested on the Strava connection.

Happy Holidays too all Smiley
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #86 - 02/02/25 at 13:58:23
 
Finally got some listening in. The system is progressing well. Hidden detail is being exposed!

I changed the setup again. Moved the DJ subs to the back and shunted the voice coils. Amplified with plate amps did not fare well with the new positioning of the 18" sub cabinets. Also, moved the Pyramids closer to the front corners. This led to a better HT experience without need to move the 10" Crystal speaker cabinets. Some gothic style window art was hung from the front wall absorbers. Pics soon.

Spent way to much time in the tech shop. Other then organizing and misc tool repair, I got some items repaired and processed. The Otair capstan board received a complete electrolytic cap change which helped with motor noise. It still needs further assessment on the control board for slow voltage rise at power up. A 350 watt plate amp got some new power supply caps that led to another issue in the preamp stage. Shelved for now. The Audiotronics record player just needed the old cartridge installed. New cartridge was garbage! Easy one! Be careful with stereoneedleslady on ebay. Bought three from her and two had issues. The Lloyd's player needed caps replaced and a short fixed that just killed batteries. It gets pretty loud now! Even repaired a favorite camp hair dryer by removing a burnt cold air button switch! The misses approved. Working on Sheldon's DAC now. I purchased an entire electrolytic cap replacement and a roll of copper tape. Installed the tape yesterday. Going to replace caps starting with B+ components, evaluate then see if furter caps need replaced.

After the DAC, there is a Zkit3 board with all needed to get 'er done. Steve does not sell the kits anymore but will sell the board. At least the ones' in stock? A Panasonic portable reel to reel that needs left channel work. A breakout box for the digital/pre stage components of a second Swiss Fuse. Balanced to unbalanced converter parts are awaiting for my attention.

Cool

John
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #87 - 02/02/25 at 16:27:03
 
Just completed the B+ cap replacement with low ESR caps. Result is increased treble balance. Some edginess. Most likely the caps need time to settle in. I have no intention to replace film caps at this time. The pic shows the four caps replaced circled. The lone one at the top serves as a drain for a string of zener diodes utilized to give much more power then the analog stage could ever need. Great for transients!

Next up heater supply caps.
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #88 - 02/02/25 at 18:26:59
 
Heater power caps are in. No noticable difference hear. The designer Sheldon did do a trick in all 4 power supplies to help reduce hash from the high speed diode bridges. Snubber caps are deployed on every leg of the diode bridge. His use of solid state rectification was the ability of higher filter capacitance as compared with tubes.

Next high frequency digital caps.
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #89 - 02/02/25 at 19:35:36
 
These four are a dump for the Burr-Brown 5volt supply. Great little engines. Noticable clarity improvement on cymbals. I been looping Steelydan's "Gaucho" since the beginning of this cap replacement project.

Saved the best and worst for last. The left and right channel power supplies have some tight areas to access the caps but should be a noticeable sound wise difference.
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #90 - 02/02/25 at 23:21:52
 
Edited. Sometimes it is cheaper to buy 10 when only 7 are needed. More confused? One of the 20 was used in the heater supply! Smiley
The last 20 Nichicon Audio grade caps 16 installed on a combination of LM317(+ legs) and LM337(-legs) regulators for digital and audio right left channels. Total costs $48.

So far the DAC sounds refreshed, musical, detailed, and different. Will have to see how it settles but it surely will give me a break while listening.
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Re: Flick's Chariot
Reply #91 - Yesterday at 15:35:00
 
We all know how that happy peaceful feeling overcomes us after a positive listening session. A smile from ear-to-ear thinking about our systems when all is well. That was the feeling after a long session two nights ago with the new cap install. Then, yesterday morning with that smile still broad, I when to warm up the system for a long day in the chariot digging further into the library finding new gems. After the first normal 20 minute chill-pill time, my smile slowly narrowed to a tight lip puss. I was baffled because the music just went flat. All the magic disappeared. I just had a two channel stereo again that only shined with the best recordings. What could have happened overnight? Can not really explain all that when thru my mind but stopped short when things got crazy in there Smiley Trying different titles without any satisfaction I finally walked away to enjoy a day with the misses.

During a good day out in the almost 60 degree weather the morning session was on a back burner simmering away. The disappointment did not ruin my mod. It was great to get out after this harsh winter and it was slowing getting to the point of being solved, maybe Smiley It has to be that nag Alexa, I thought.

Let me explain.

My mains power cleansing is a passive bank of capacitors and balance transformer as most know who have been following the Chariot's evolution here. Before heading down stairs for a session I tell Alexa to turn on the capacitor bank so to give those a head start charging up. My device is a TpLink WiFi wall plug. Just plugging 400uf of capacitance into 120 volt mains will destroy a receptacle and plug in short order. The noise from the spark will open eyes quick. This has been done for years without any issue until recently when the smart plug relay had enough of it and quit making connection because the contacts pitted. I replaced it with another smart plug that was used for the oil heater in the room. That lasted a whole 2 weeks before it failed in the same manner. I replaced it with another less used TpLink  plug that mainly powered christmas lights. Thinking that it should be good for a couple of years because of it's use, it was forgotten. Well, you most likely guessed that it was responsible for my broken session.

Being inquisitive, the smart plugs were disassemble. It was found that the first burnt plug has 17 amp 250 volt relay. The last one to fail has 16 amp 250 volt contacts. Reminds me of a half gallon tub of ice cream that has turned into 48oz over the years.



Back to the Chariot Cool



 
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