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It was really interesting to me reading these first responses. With different ultimate thoughts for which amp was favored, I think all three make sense. But for simplicity. I will comment mostly on the first two posts... though the context of speakers were notable for all three.
My other main thought was how much the 25th mods influence what we experience with these amps, likely an important consideration in looking at impressions. I hope I have this right Lon, but I am thinking your segue back to low power was 1st in difficult listening circumstances....like a small space and having to listen near field? Then, in your next rooms, didn't you start to integrate the 25th mods then? Just wondering, since your systems now have a number of pieces made with 25th mods, as well as 25th modified older pieces, how might mods, room changes, and listening habits (in your somewhat newly-married life) influence comparisons to your MKIII Torii without mods?
As I recall Steve's impressions from mods on the Torii IV, I am pretty sure he said the Torii improved exceptionally compared to others at the time, and that he may not of made the Mystery amp had he known how far he could take the Torii IV with mods??? Sorry, I can't figure out how to easily find the post that comes to mind in those long mod threads, so my words, but this is the gist of what I recall.
Just thinking that I can certainly imagine how you would prefer modded low power amps over modded higher power ones. But also we know non-modded amps are really quite different from modded ones, so wondering how that might effect impressions of a given amp.
I have not heard Steve's modifications, but my Torii IV modifications include a different but similar version of power supply and input resistor upgrades, while upgrading other areas as well, and the results are mind bending to me. My wife is more science oriented in training, and her mind works much better than mine at conservative and careful analysis with percentages. She stopped counting quite a while ago as my collective mods to Torii, CSP3 and HR-1s went to 2-2.5 times better than the pretty tuned up stock system for refinement of sonic values and enhanced musical experience. Sounds crazy, but I am talking refinements that make it more like real music, and how do we gauge those...part of why I am not good at percentage statements. But whatever, power supply and resistor mods effect lots across the spectrum, improving and refining most values we can attribute to more refined sonics, and to more complete musical experience.
The other thing that occurred to me was speakers. I have heard variations of both, F-15 baffles (Groovy), and HR-1s (Lon), from online representations at Decfest and on demo recordings Steve has made... Not perfect but pretty nicely indicative of the differences. And I own HR-1s, so feel relatively confident saying these speakers have similarities, but quite different ways of conveying music. To me they are both good, but notably different flavors. And I don't know how Groovy's DIY F-15 baffles compare, but imagine, set up with bass supplementation, it is at least in the neighborhood of Steve's big baffles??? But to me the HR-1s reflect different sonic choices, giving a rounder, softer, and "warmer" overall feel than Steve's baffles. Basically I find the F-15s faster and "clearer" feeling than HR-1s, while still being harmonically rich and complex....And my preferences put me somewhere in between for my HR modifications.
Anyway, I suspect speaker and other differences could easily influence one's amp preferences...the HR-1 warming up and softening the low power amps, and the Torii IV beefing up and warming F-15 baffles? I will be interested in you all's thoughts, but if this seems real, then how would these ZUs play into this equation?
When I compared lower power amps in my room, with a nicely tuned, but unmodded Torii, my rooms are bigger, contributing, but with my more clarified and faster HR-1s, I really missed the power from the Torii. And not just for volume, but for how the Torii pushed the small drivers harder, as well as the Torii being tonally more weighty, bigger, fuller in my live sounding room, while still having excellent fine detail and space.
If I had the F-15 baffles, though I can't guess which I would like better in my room without hearing them, I imagine that signature would have influenced my amp impressions in pretty big ways. Online and listening to recordings, I really like the sound of Big Baffles and the 25th Zen, noticing a musical clarity and speed with really nice complexity, and not noticing a lack of weight or "power." But those are big, fast, musical and efficient drivers, actively contribute to making a big, impactful sound.
Just a few thoughts to add to the conversation. I can imagine a modified Torii, or modified monos, or the 25th Zen all sounding great though with efficient speakers.
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